you say they are illegal so is drinking and driving but it still happens, why would want to bring up a safety issue so late in the world of airsoft .Im with josh and mad you did a half cocked job on your investghation


But we all love you

AMEN!!!!!!!! Thank you Madrule

whoa lol

You guys have had your chance to talk sh!t. IF THIS BECOMES SOME MASSIVE PISSING CONTEST I'LL DELETE IT. Debating an augment has nothing to do with put downs, keep it clean and cite your sources.

Ah how times have changed since I took a break from airsoft lol

First off, why people are getting so upset over this deal, I cannot understand. Regardless of the outcome, why make a huge deal about it? When I went to games back up North, there were certain gear or gun items we could not use, and a few times, we found out on the fly at certain events Did we throw a pity party or complain? No - my old squad I use to run with all basically said "Alright...fine..when does the game start because we don't want to be late." We cared more about playing the game, having fun, and just going out there to be the best team possible (and individual players as well); not if they wanted to "take things away for us", for legal or non-legal issues...ok. Cool - we like a challenge...make it harder for us to win.

So personally, why people are throwing a fit, regardless of what side of the argument they are on for this issue, I don't understand. Maybe it's just my youth talking but so be it. Most of us are adults - we should handle challenges that arise as adults: put personal differences aside, address the issue at hand, find an agreeable solution, and move on.

Now as far as the issue goes - if they're illegal, they should not be used - plain and simple. If they are legal, fine - let them be used. If it is still up in the air, I'd personally side with caution and not use them. This is my view and my opinion - others, obviously, have different ideas. So be it. Regardless, I believe, it is up to the event holder(s) and the field owner(s) to come up with a decision that best reflects valid, safety rules. If these so-called homemade airsoft grenades fall within the rules - fantastic! If not, maybe it's best not to use them. This is, of course, unless a valid, certified expert from the law says "yes" or "no" on the issue.

Point and case - let's stop the name calling, begin to act like adults, and move on. Hell guys...it's only a sport, and I'd like my first Alabama Airsoft event not to be my last due to petty bickering, which is unattractive. Just because you "killed" someone at one event or game more than he did to you...so what? It's like football or any other sport - any certain team on any certain day can beat any certain opponent, regardless of the opponent's skill level. Just remember - usually, we all learn more from losing than we do from winning. From losing, you can see and figure out what you might have done wrong - leads to wisdom and experience.

Anyho - wish yall the best and look forward to the game in November. Looking forward to finally meeting some of yall.

God Bless & Best Wishes,
Nick Petrus - Original Owner/Main Editor of U.S.A.S.O.C. - The Magazine

Faithful,

Some of this debate is over preserving youthful airsoft. There are plenty of young players that get excited about making these things and the excitement is welcomed. I don't object to the illegality of TP grenades. And, I don't disagree with your objection to unsavory comments. I'm not sure what you are use to as far as forum rules and admin intervention is but we try to let everyone boast their options to a point. We discourage sh!t talk but we are not above letting people voice their emotion, for better or good, online. Obviously, this is where life collides. We try to keep it simple and civil. I sure you have noticed we have a very relaxed approach to many circumstances but sometimes you can't just delete a thread.


Forums,

I know some of you really look forward to making TP/ E. egg grenades but you are going to have to hold off on using them right now. I personally know its fun making them. I have made many batches myself, but if its going to jeopardize a landowner's insurance policy its unforgivable. There is to be no use of , in any circumstance, TP/ Easter egg grenades used at Alabama Airosft Forums posted games until they are deemed fit for use by the authorities,

There has been action taken to supplement to the need for cheap grenades and I think they will be adequate in the majority of all airsoft.

It seems to me that this isn't even about the grenades at all anymore and more about why it was even made an issue at all,and who started it.yes i'm new to this forum,but I've been into it for over 10 years and have recently had the privilage of playing with some of you guys.After reading everything that was said,I'd have to say that I sided with what Madrule has quoted.This in my opinion falls into catagories such as why don't we just obey all the laws and put the orange tips back on,don't impersonate any military or police officials,stop playing with guns that look to real.bann the right to bare arms,kill all pitbulls ,lol i mean the list goes on.but hey why listen to me.I don't have a published magazine,I'm just a dumb hick

By the way has there been any accidents where anyone was hurt or killed to even warent this issue?Just because other states have their laws doesn't make it our problem does it?When it happens then we should deal with it and abide those rules but until then we should enjoy ouselves with the freedom we have now before our govermnet takes that away as well,lol.

signed your neighborhood Nobody

Doug, the owner of Mt Doom, has made this a moot point as far as it deals with me Here are his comments on thesubject "Players, I have been reading several threads on this forum regarding the use of an explosive firecracker surrounded by BB's contained in a tube or cardboard holder. This sounds like it would be fun and sounds like it would be fairly safe and all but when you take a moment to really think about the topic I hope you will see why we can't allow them at Mt. Doom. If a company manufactured these devices then maybe we could take a look at them but when you say HOMEMADE you open a whole nuther can-of-worms. There will always be the good-ole-boy who says if One M90 makes a pretty good pop then think what three or four would do! Or decides to scoop a couple of spoon fulls of Pyrodex into a tightly bound tube. But even beyond this I have two very serious reasons we cannot allow explosive bombs on my field. First is the insurance policy. They say NO NO NO to this. They are cool with C02 powered land mines or spring loaded grenades or mines but never never never explosive chemicals (i.e. gunpowder or gases). Second is FIRE. I have witnessed half a dozen fires started by little smoke bombs bought at the firecracker stand or even those that are commercially made for scenario paintball or airsoft play. Even the "cold burning" smoke bombs have started fires here. The last thing I want is a player lighting a spewing and flaming fuse and throwing the device off into the woods! These woods are DEEP in old pine straw and leaves and I have seen fires start and get LARGE in just seconds so for these reasons I cannot allow them on the field. Now there is a way you can safely use smoke bombs here and in a manner I approve of. You would have a referee assigned to set the bomb in the middle of the roadway or a large cleared to the dirt area and ignite it himself and then watch it burn and after it is out and cool either take it to a garbage can or dig a hole and bury it on the field. I would have no problem with a pyrotechnic device used in this manner but we are talking about smoke bombs not gernades. You could use simulated gernades and have a ref call players inside the "blast zone" eliminated or you could use the honor system or you can buy spring loaded gernades or CO2 dispersed gernades but not gun powder exploding gernades. Thanks for your understanding and cooperation on this issue. Soon as somebody makes one that is guaranteed safe we will be good with it." With that said, There is no need for me to pursue this anymore. Patrick, if you want to pcik up the torch and get a difinative answer that you could put in you magazine and forward to regoinal fields that is up to you. That is something that I fully support and will offer any assitance that you need. I still have all of the numbers and names for a sound pick up point. I will post a new thread in the Genreal forums with links to some cost efficient alternatives to the these grenades.

A3, when your article is completed, will it be posted on the forum? If so, can forum members provide it to other airsofters without copyright violation?

Thanks, this is an issue that should be shared with as many airsofters a s possible.

IMO ... .it should be swept back under the rug and not mentioned anymore.....

I second that motion!

For future reference...

I am a member of the Tripoli Rocketry Association, a global organization that promotes the hobby of sport, scale, high power and and amateur rocketry. This past March 16th, we, as an organization defeated the BATFE in a court battle, where-by their claims, rocket propellant, specifically, Ammonium Perchlorat Composite Propellant (APCP) was an explosive. A little background: the shuttle SRB's run on APCP, and so do our hobby motors. During this court battle, members of the rocketry community were having to file for and get a Low Explosives User Permit (LEUP) in order to use APCP over a certain weight...that is a mess that you do not want to get involved with.

We won the court battle proving that rocket propellant does not function by explosion, therefore it should be removed from the BATFE's explove list: http://www.dragonworksrocketry.com/http:/www.dragonworksrocketry.com/347/victory-for-tra-nar-today/ Wow, that is great...it was a 10-year battle, starting in 1999, and $100,000+ (plus) later, we finally had a judge agree with us, that APCP is not an explosive, and should be removed from the explosives list...if it was an explosive, do you think NASA would launch a shuttle? No, if APCP was an explosive they would blow all the shuttles up! ...Challenger aside, that explosion was caused from a leaky booster, that ignited the large liquid tank...

Point is, we do not have the backing to take the BATFE to court to prove what we would like to do is harmless...in their eyes, we would be altering an explosive devise to expel shrapnel, under any law, that is not good...watch the news, everything that is happening, can be directly traced back to 9-11...how long we live in that shadow I do not know...but the BATFE have been granted full reign over any and all explosives since the Homeland Security Act was signed into law...

I have been following this argument, and I know that the owners of Mnt Doom have expressed their own concerns, and these items are not allowed anyways...but for future reference, you can and will go to jail for your actions, and the media will sensationalise it as being related to terrorism, and you will be buried by the system...the linked thread is long, but read the article it pertains too, it is in the first post:

http://www.rocketryplanet.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2175

research your activities, and ask the hard questions that you really don't know or want to know the answers to...A3, researching material for his article, did right by asking the hard questions no one else wants to, and received the answers that no one wants to hear...I await his article.

Make amends with those you have gotten angry with on this subject, and then go out and have some fun...and more importantly, be safe...